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Office of Personnel Management

OPM is responsible for several broad categories such as employee recruitment and retention and oversees the overall federal workforce including managing, job announcement postings at USAJOBS.gov and setting governmentwide policies on hiring procedures.
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Fedgirl96  
#21 Posted : Wednesday, June 9, 2021 4:33:09 PM(UTC)
Fedgirl96

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Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
A LOR is still not adverse action (per the MSPB and EEOC), and can be used for 1 time events. Would I do so for one time being late by less than an hour with no prior counseling/emails for similar issues? Probably not...and we would have a serious discussion. As for not responding when teleworking (when you should have been in the office per your post)...the biggest issue for me would be you were not where you should have been. And without any calls or emails from you letting me know this, I would presume you are AWOL. I'd try contacting you too..and if you are not responsive, then some paperwork (at least a letter of counseling) would be forthcoming. As a supervisor, you are responsible for all the people who work for you. And if one is not where they are supposed to be (as in general location, not the specific desk. I'm talking in the office building vs home vs TDY location), and when I reach out to them via email/IM/text etc, and they only respond when I call (or after a few calls), then that is actionable behavior (it is a conduct issue as apposed to a performance issue).

Hopefully for you, your supervisor did not go through the ER/LR folks in HR, which would potentially render the LOR invalid and they may drop it to simply you were counseled and don't do it again.




Is ER/LR the EO folks? What ido you mean “hopefully she did not go through”? How would I even know? She seems to be trying to rush to get this submitted? Maybe bc new commander takes over this week?

Sorry for all the questions. I was really blindsided by the entire situation
FS0201  
#22 Posted : Wednesday, June 9, 2021 5:03:04 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Fedgirl96 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: frankgonzalez Go to Quoted Post
A LOR is still not adverse action (per the MSPB and EEOC), and can be used for 1 time events. Would I do so for one time being late by less than an hour with no prior counseling/emails for similar issues? Probably not...and we would have a serious discussion. As for not responding when teleworking (when you should have been in the office per your post)...the biggest issue for me would be you were not where you should have been. And without any calls or emails from you letting me know this, I would presume you are AWOL. I'd try contacting you too..and if you are not responsive, then some paperwork (at least a letter of counseling) would be forthcoming. As a supervisor, you are responsible for all the people who work for you. And if one is not where they are supposed to be (as in general location, not the specific desk. I'm talking in the office building vs home vs TDY location), and when I reach out to them via email/IM/text etc, and they only respond when I call (or after a few calls), then that is actionable behavior (it is a conduct issue as apposed to a performance issue).

Hopefully for you, your supervisor did not go through the ER/LR folks in HR, which would potentially render the LOR invalid and they may drop it to simply you were counseled and don't do it again.




Is ER/LR the EO folks? What ido you mean “hopefully she did not go through”? How would I even know? She seems to be trying to rush to get this submitted? Maybe bc new commander takes over this week?

Sorry for all the questions. I was really blindsided by the entire situation


1) ER/LR and EEO are not the same.
2) Not to put words in Frank’s mouth, but I would assume that he means that if the supervisor didn’t go through ER, the reprimand would likely fail on a grievance. I would say it is incredibly unlikely that this happened, but it is possible, and I have seen it at least once.
3) If you disagree with the reprimand, file a grievance or more on. I don’t see a reprimand as a big deal; it is a wake up call, which seems to have worked already.
4) I don’t understand idea that supervisor rushed process due to change in commander.
5) Only briefly pursuing the thread, I would have likely written a reprimand based kn what you wrote. I have done for much less.
The excuse of, "I read it on FederalSoup..." won't work. Please do your due diligence.
frankgonzalez  
#23 Posted : Sunday, June 13, 2021 12:51:55 PM(UTC)
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1) ER/LR and EEO are not the same.- Thanks for getting this before me. Us EEO folks are neutrals whereas the ER/LR folks represent the agency.
2) Not to put words in Frank’s mouth, but I would assume that he means that if the supervisor didn’t go through ER, the reprimand would likely fail on a grievance. I would say it is incredibly unlikely that this happened, but it is possible, and I have seen it at least once.- Yep, exactly what I mean. I have seen this more frequently occur when the supervisor is military and tries to do the same thing they do with the military.
3) If you disagree with the reprimand, file a grievance or more on. I don’t see a reprimand as a big deal; it is a wake up call, which seems to have worked already.
4) I don’t understand idea that supervisor rushed process due to change in commander. -Typically because they want the paperwork in place before the new commander asks questions...especially if things are not completely accurate.
5) Only briefly pursuing the thread, I would have likely written a reprimand based kn what you wrote. I have done for much less.I agree. Based on the original post, I can easily see a LOR..but would have pulled that trigger on the day spent at home when they were supposed to be in the office. But then again, I'm not a warm fuzzy person.

You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
Fedgirl96  
#24 Posted : Wednesday, June 16, 2021 10:02:49 AM(UTC)
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Thanks again. After reading the replies I was just going to let it go and take it as an opportunity to improve.
But….today on my way into office, I get held up going through security about 2 minutes and to be safe I notify my boss that I’ll be 5-7 minutes late, taking into account I always stop to wash my hands, turn on my computer, put my things down etc. Up until today I thought I was on a flex schedule. But honestly I have no idea anymore what the rules/ polices are and have to find out along the way. But even that doesn’t work since guidance changes with moods.

I had to submit a leave form for five minutes. Yes five minutes. Which isn’t even possible since it’s done in increments of 15. So I had to take 15 minutes of leave. I made sure to annotate in comments that I wasn’t 15 minutes late. It tuned out I arrived at my desk 2 minutes late.

I thought guidance was consistent and supervisors had to follow some sort of guidance. Or essentially employees are all treated fairly? It takes more time and effort to fill a leave form than it does for me to stay late. Which has always been the course of action in the past.

I don’t care what the guidance is… I just want to know exactly what the guidance is? I’ve read the one appraisal I’ve received since I arrived here last year, none of the current issues outlines any rules. My appraisals and mid year reviews are the only documents I’ve received outlining any expectations.


I’m guessing ER is really HR? I don’t know what she or who she consulted with. I do know it’s already in my E-OPF with the effective date of June 8. Even thought I didn’t sign until 9th and returned 10th. I also thought if I grieved it, then it won’t go into my file?

I’m starting to believe people can do what they want and it all boils down to who is the higher grade.
frankgonzalez  
#25 Posted : Wednesday, June 16, 2021 12:05:50 PM(UTC)
frankgonzalez

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Originally Posted by: Fedgirl96 Go to Quoted Post
Thanks again. After reading the replies I was just going to let it go and take it as an opportunity to improve.
But….today on my way into office, I get held up going through security about 2 minutes and to be safe I notify my boss that I’ll be 5-7 minutes late, taking into account I always stop to wash my hands, turn on my computer, put my things down etc. Up until today I thought I was on a flex schedule. But honestly I have no idea anymore what the rules/ polices are and have to find out along the way. But even that doesn’t work since guidance changes with moods.

I had to submit a leave form for five minutes. Yes five minutes. Which isn’t even possible since it’s done in increments of 15. So I had to take 15 minutes of leave. I made sure to annotate in comments that I wasn’t 15 minutes late. It tuned out I arrived at my desk 2 minutes late.

I thought guidance was consistent and supervisors had to follow some sort of guidance. Or essentially employees are all treated fairly? It takes more time and effort to fill a leave form than it does for me to stay late. Which has always been the course of action in the past.

I don’t care what the guidance is… I just want to know exactly what the guidance is? I’ve read the one appraisal I’ve received since I arrived here last year, none of the current issues outlines any rules. My appraisals and mid year reviews are the only documents I’ve received outlining any expectations.


I’m guessing ER is really HR? I don’t know what she or who she consulted with. I do know it’s already in my E-OPF with the effective date of June 8. Even thought I didn’t sign until 9th and returned 10th. I also thought if I grieved it, then it won’t go into my file?

I’m starting to believe people can do what they want and it all boils down to who is the higher grade.
You can grieve it, and if your grievance is upheld, then it is pulled. Your signature isn't the effective date, it is the date the supervisor issued it. (ER= Employee Relations, LR= Labor Relations. Both are in HR and specifically work with managers on issues with employees).

You need to verify what your work schedule is. If it is flex schedule, you need to clarify what that means. In some cases, it means your days can vary, but in coordination with your supervisor. In others, it means as long as you are there during core hours, your start and end times can vary and you need to ensure you have 80 per pay period.

You also need to clarify what the leave policy is for your agency and work center.

You should have voted Cthulu...the greatest of all Evils
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